Author Topic: Tyson Gay on how he has trained  (Read 17721 times)

Tinman

  • Global Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3779
    • View Profile
    • Email
Tyson Gay on how he has trained
« on: June 01, 2009, 10:42:12 PM »
Asked what he meant by "no speed-work", Gay explained, "Speed-work in practice is maybe 60m fast, 30m fast, running and running and running.

Regarding "speedwork"....

I haven't really touched it yet. I may have done a couple 60ms in practice, and some starts, that's considered speed-work, but I haven't really turned my body on. I've been doing 400m and longer distances."


Yet, he ran 19.58 for the 200m. Does anyone see that sepeedwork is  not nearly as important as people make it out to be? Strength-endurance is the key to success. Add to it technical skills training and strategy and you have 99% of what you need.
Tinman
(coaching available)
Inquire via email:
runfastcoach@gmail.com

Jman

  • Guest
Tyson Gay on how he has trained
« Reply #1 on: June 02, 2009, 04:07:00 AM »
Tinman,

Im not sure were you saw your article, but this is what I have from the New Jersey Sport. His workouts consist (mainly of sprinting 60s and 100s).

He said recently, his routine has "hovered more in the 400  range" not over. Leading him to wonder how fast he might be able to go.

Tinman you are making it seem as if he is doing regular long runs like us. Maybe it's more than one report put out?

From what I've seen, Bolt had alot of speed - endurance workouts in his training not 400s or longer.  They wont catch him playing around with a 400 and longer training program.

Jman

Tinman

  • Global Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3779
    • View Profile
    • Email
Tyson Gay on how he has trained
« Reply #2 on: June 03, 2009, 02:23:41 PM »
On more than one occassion Tyson Gay (in previous years too) has said he does a lot of longer "strength" work or "endurance" work like 400m repeats. I recall reading an interview, while I was in Eugene, OR to watch a meet at Hayward Field (can't remember if it was the Prefontaine Classic or the US Olympic Trials) that he does a lot over longer intervals. This is not much different than the Clyde Hart and John Smith way of training sprinters: lot of longer intervals, long hills, technique work, for most of the year and then short speedwork in the summer.
Tinman
(coaching available)
Inquire via email:
runfastcoach@gmail.com

Tinman

  • Global Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3779
    • View Profile
    • Email
Tyson Gay on how he has trained
« Reply #3 on: June 03, 2009, 03:42:29 PM »
Here is the IAAF Track & Field article in which Tyson Gay was quoted as saying he hasn't touched speedwork yet (other than a very small amount):

http://www.iaaf.org/WCH09/news/kind=103/newsid=50825.html


My point is this: The vast majority of speed is genetically endowed. Overemphasizing pure speedwork is folly - a waste of time and energy - for runners who lack natural speed. Refinement of technique and strengthening legs for faster running is fine, for everyone, but only people endowed to sprint (fast twitch fibers) will sprint fast. It's just the way it is. Just like you can't take a Tyson Gay and make him a world-class marathon runner. No matter how many miles he runs, he'll never be faster than the average Joe runner over the marathon distance. The smarter approach to training is blend together key training elements properly. For a guy or gal who is naturally endowed for long distances, that means he or she will do a small amount of technical skills training and a small amount of sprint/speed work. For the guy or gal who was always fast on the playground as a kid compared to everybody else and ran the 50 yard dash at the top  level for the President's Physical Fitness Challenge, running more speedwork, more technical training, and more strength training is going to help improve running performance over a wide variety of race-distances.

Lesson: Always, the focus of training must be on each person's natural abilities.

To sum the above with an analogy, I"ll quote my grandfather, who was a Bronc-buster (horse trainer) in the early 1900's: "You can't make a Kentucky derby winner out of plowhorse; and you can't make a thoroughbreed pull a heavy cart for hours. 'Horses to courses' is the way to think about it." Use your gifts, develop your natural talents wisely, and don't waste valuable time and energy trying to make yourself train like somebody you are  not. I would never train Jman to be a marathon runner. Running 120 miles per week would ruin him! He's naturally fast, like a Kentucky Derby throughbreed horse. He's made to run 1.5-2 minute very fast. He ran run a 400 fast, and 800m fast, and a decent 1 mile. He can run longer distance strongly, as long as he trains in accordance with his body's need for speed. If you gave Jman 120 miles per week at 6:30-7:00 pace, he would feel awful and race slowly, I have no doubt. For him, probably 65 miles per week will make him tougher than nails at 10k to the half-marathon, and for the 800m, probably 60 miles per week for his base and 40 miles per week for his racing season is about right. Wed' have to ask Jman what he did at his best, for various distances, but the important thing is to learn to train in accordance with what one's  body needs.

Take care,

Tinman
Tinman
(coaching available)
Inquire via email:
runfastcoach@gmail.com

Jman

  • Guest
Tyson Gay on how he has trained
« Reply #4 on: June 04, 2009, 03:42:08 AM »
Tinman,

I agree with most of what you said, but I am not a natural fast runner.   I train smat and hard for the events I compete in.  I am always working on my running.  
tonight I just finished a 5k workout.

I warmed up  with a easy workout on a hill tonight, took a break did my speed drills and ran a 9:03/3000 on the road.

Tinman this was not easy, I worked on this workout for almost two years.  It is one of 20 workouts in my training programs for Master runners.

I practice how I like to race. To some this is training too fast and hard, but if you want to run fast times you have to train hard. Training fast is something I work hard on, it's not natural for me.

We have to be careful with those words it's like saiyng the person doesn't have to work at it. I ran a 50.90 /400 meters two weeks ago, training with  Dennis Duffy and the guys in Fresno CA.

I put a half of year of hard training in this year at the 400 meters as a Master runner.  My speed - endurance program was the reason for the 50.90, not naturall speed at all.  I still have two more months to work on fine tuning my technique.

I am running the Fathers Day  6 mile run this year, but I always have some type of training to cover it. We have to train to run good, it the only way to go. It about speed and endurance and hard work not one or the other.

Here is a 10k race, I ran after track season in 1996 in Palo Alto CA. I train  hard for the short and long races.

All my races I put the time and hard training in to run good.

http://www.paloaltoonline.com/moonlight_run/moon96_10k.php
« Last Edit: June 04, 2009, 04:01:42 AM by Jman »

ap4305

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 924
    • View Profile
    • Pike Athletics
    • Email
Tyson Gay on how he has trained
« Reply #5 on: June 04, 2009, 02:20:22 PM »
Quote from: Jman;7814
I train smat and hard for the events I compete in.  I am always working on my running.  
tonight I just finished a 5k workout.

I warmed up  with a easy workout on a hill tonight, took a break did my speed drills and ran a 9:03/3000 on the road.



That workout seems to support Tinman's points quite well.  You're a strong middle distance runner, and that workout touches on the major performance elements required for those events: leg strength (hills), turnover (speed drills), and speed endurance (fast 3k).  If you were naturally suited for sprints, those speed drills might be all-out speedwork and if you were pure distance that fast 3k might be a longer tempo run.  Instead, you have settled in the middle, which is not suprisingly where you choose to race and where your body seems most suited.

Tinman

  • Global Moderator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3779
    • View Profile
    • Email
Tyson Gay on how he has trained
« Reply #6 on: June 04, 2009, 03:55:04 PM »
Jman -

You are either humble about your speed or unaware of how fast you are. Tell me how many people at your age can run 50 seconds in the 400m? I bet you ran 48 or 47 seconds in your early 30's, back when you ran 1:48 in the 800m. Seriously, Jman, you are very talented compared to the average person; and your speed is way faster than 95% of us could dream about. I was on a team of 120 male track & field runners, at the University of Wisconsin - La Crosse. For many years we were national champions in track & field. In the 400m training group there was anywhere 20-30 runners (more like 30, typically), and only about 25% of those guys ran below 50 seconds. They trained hard, seriously hard on both speed and speed-endurance. People like Andrew Rock, who was a world class 400m runner, came from that group, so you know they didn't just jog around. I recall watching our top 400m guys do 8 x 400m in 56 seconds down to 52 seconds with a 2 minute walk recovery, and I saw the top four guys run 10 x 200m in 26 seconds with a 2 minute recovery. I saw fast 50's, 100's and 150's (all-out). I saw them run repeat hills at balls-out effort. They were not sloughing off, I can assure you, and those guys were running workouts all fall, too. The ran from September to the end of May, doing hard reps, hard weight training, hard everthing, and lots of drills and hills, too. Again, only 25% of those guys ran below 50 flat. Now, here's the point, the 30 guys who trained for the 400m had been sprinters in high school. They were NOT distance guys dropping down to the 400m. They had trained seriously for sprints, typically, for 4 or more years, yet only 6-8 guys per year could break 50 seconds in the 400m.

Personally, I could have trained for 10 years, doing 400m training, and never hit 50 flat. I did a ton of speedwork in high school and a lot of speed-endurance workouts as a middle distance guy in college, and I never broke  52 seconds. I could, however, run 56-57 seconds, walk 2- minutes, and do 4 of those. Yeah, that may seem like an easy workout for you, but I was running just 3-4 seconds slower than all-out. I was tested in our Human Performance lab, when I was a graduate student in Exercise Science, for fiber typing, and the results showed 72% slow twitch and 28% fast twitch; of which 7% was type b (now called type X) - the most explosive kind. I didn't have the natural fiber types to run a fast 400m or fast 800m. I was a typical 5k runner, in terms of fiber typing. The only problem I had was lower leg compartment syndrome, which prevented me from running enough mileage to use my natural talents.

It doesn't matter how much speedwork you give me, I am not going to run 50 flat! Sorry!. It's like saying Albrerto Salazar didn't do speedwork, and he was sloughing off, because he couldn't break 55 seconds in the 400m. I've briefly talked with Salazar, in Portland, OR at track clinic at the Radison hotel where he was a guest speaker. He said he could run 16 x 200m in 30 seconds with a 30 seconds rest, but he couldn't run under 55 seconds to save his life. He said, "I was strong, very strong, and I had great mental toughness." He just didn't have the fiber types to run a 400m fast. He was a 93% slow twitcher, according to tests performed on him. NO amount of speedwork emphasis in the world would make Salazar a 50 flat runner. Sorry, aint gonna happen! Salazar even went to Houston, Texas to be trained by Tom Tellez, the world-famous sprint coach, and Tellez told him the same thing; that Salazar was never going to be a fast sprinter, but Salazar could improve his efficiency of sprinting to carry his limited speed further (this was from Salazar's mouth!).
Tinman
(coaching available)
Inquire via email:
runfastcoach@gmail.com

Jman

  • Guest
Tyson Gay on how he has trained
« Reply #7 on: June 04, 2009, 10:56:45 PM »
Hey Retread,

How is your training going this year on the roads?  I see you have'nt posted any runs for some time.

Have you run the Palo Alto Moonlight  weekly 10k before, I believe its in your backyard? The 31:30 was about 1:15 seconds off my fastest time.

I wonder if you were in the same race, I saw three Jim's in the results. When is your next race this year, and what is your goal?

Jman
« Last Edit: June 04, 2009, 11:00:43 PM by Jman »

 




Facebook Comments