Tinman's New Running Calculator

Featuring TheRunZone?s resident coach Tinman. All participants are welcome to post and reply to topics in this section whether you?re looking for advice, or sharing your own coaching experience.

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tcl
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Re: Tinman's New Running Calculator

Post by tcl » Mon Mar 02, 2015 11:32 am

Thanks, Tinman. In my opinion, stories like what you've just posted are the most useful among the many great things on this site. They provide a kind of detail and context you can't get any other way.

Other posters: any thoughts on how to manage the very small part of training that's devoted to speeds faster than (say) VO2 pace? For me, it's usually just a modest set of strides, done by feel, at the end of a run or workout. I wonder if it's useful to try to be more precise in hitting (some of) the anaerobic intensities on Tinman's chart. I don't mean going harder, just making distinctions among "fast-ish" paces. Or maybe it's enough just to make sure the strides feel like 75% to 90% of a max sprint effort...

CoachRonG
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Re: Tinman's New Running Calculator

Post by CoachRonG » Mon Mar 02, 2015 12:19 pm

At the end of a CV workout you could try 3 x 200 with a 200 jog descending from anaerobic endurance, to anaerobic power and finally speed endurance pace. Just enough to keep you "in touch" with these paces and their neuromuscular qualities.

Tinman
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Re: Tinman's New Running Calculator

Post by Tinman » Mon Mar 02, 2015 11:50 pm

tcl -

If you are not close to peaking (meaning within about a month of your goal race), it's smart to use plenty of recovery between faster reps and not run too many of them. So, 3-4 x 200m @ Anaerobic Endurance pace will work fine for developing leg power, boost anaerobic glycolysis capacity, and improve neural coordination for running fast. The least you should recover is a 200m jog between reps. But, you certainly may want to use longer jog recoveries. This advise assumes your race distance is 5km or longer.

Regards,

Tinman
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tcl
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Re: Tinman's New Running Calculator

Post by tcl » Tue Mar 03, 2015 6:36 pm

Thanks, both of you. When I'm in shape I race 5K, plus the mile (when I can) and 10K (when there's no other choice). I haven't done anything fast for awhile, so 3-4 x 200 at anaerobic endurance pace, with ample rest, sounds like the way to go for now at least.

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Re: Tinman's New Running Calculator

Post by Sparky » Mon May 09, 2016 5:10 pm

Hi al. This is my first post on this site so apologies for resurrecting an old thread, but this thread seems like the right place to ask the question I would like to ask.

Firstly though I would like to say that I have a very, very basic knowledge of technical running terms - I just tend to run at the pace my plan asks me too without asking too many questions as to why.

My question is related to the calculator. I was shown what I think is an older version of the calculator by a friend:

http://www.runningprs.com/runnerscalculator.htm

Using this calculator my CV pace is 6:34/mile and my threshold 6:47 and tempo 7:09

So then I went looking around the site and found this calculator:

http://www.runningprs.com/calc2/index.php


Using this calculator my CV pace is 6:42- 6:34/mile and my threshold 7:02-6:52 and tempo 7:23-7:12. There's a bit of a difference there wrt the Threshold and Tempo paces. I've done a few searches of the site and come up blank so I would appreciate any help whatsoever in explaining the differences between the two calculators. And should I use the first link or the second.

For what its worth CV pace for me is about the pace I would race a 4 to 5 mile race at the lower end, which I end up doing a few times a year, so I enjoy training at this pace.

Again apologies if this has already been answered elsewhere and any help will be gratefully received.

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Re: Tinman's New Running Calculator

Post by dilluh » Tue May 10, 2016 11:05 am

The older calculator gave a single pace while the new calculator gives a range of paces. That's really the main difference. Tinman may provide more info if he has tweaked his formulas significantly between the first and second calculator. My guess is that he didn't or did very minor changes.

I believe a range of paces is a smarter way to represent these efforts. The reason being that you do not feel 100% every time you go out to do a workout, nor is the weather absolutely perfect every time you go to the track for a CV workout. The range allows for you to adjust paces based on how you feel THAT DAY. This is really important in the context of keeping the ball rolling. Too many times in the past I would hit paces on my workouts and be a bit fried by the end of the workout but I did the workout because that's the pace I'm supposed to run, right? Wrong, you shouldn't over-extend in order to hit a specific time. The workouts can be challenging, for sure, but always within yourself.

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Re: Tinman's New Running Calculator

Post by Tinman » Tue May 10, 2016 5:41 pm

I provided a range of paces in the newer calculator for a couple of reasons. First, I prefer that runners start at the slow end of the range and speed up during the workout as they feel more warmed up. I think it's a safer approach to training and one that should reduce any chances of injury. Further, there's a psychological element to finding a groove in running. Starting at the slower end of the range provides quick access to that groove feeling, while immediately going to the fast end may not, if you have not warmed up hard. Finally, I know that runners tend to not be always aware of what their body is ready for in a workout. If you are like I was as a runner, I tended to think that my training day performance capacity was equal to my race day capacity, which was not true. I had to work harder on a training day to reach the same pace than on race-day. So, by starting at the slow end of the range, I think the chances are better that you will be close to the right pace and can adjust as needed. In contrast, if you overestimate your ability that day, you might just burn your matches in the workout and leave yourself a bit shy of full strength on race-day. Better to be conservative and speed up than go too fast, early-on, and then strain, instead of train!
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Re: Tinman's New Running Calculator

Post by Sparky » Thu May 12, 2016 12:36 am

Thanks for the replies. It does make sense to me have a range - I would always give myself a range of 10 or 15 secs/mile anyway. And yes I would generally perform better in races than in workouts, hitting paces easier than in tempos is long intervals. Tinman - if I might just ask one more question by way of clarification. Have you changed the formula for the new calculator?Because even the fastest end of the range for threshold and tempo are slower than the single pace on the older calculator. Thanks again folks.

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Re: Tinman's New Running Calculator

Post by Tinman » Fri May 13, 2016 10:29 pm

Formulas are the same. I just adjusted the target percentages by a small amount. Enjoy our day!
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Re: Tinman's New Running Calculator

Post by djjazzyjoel22 » Sat Oct 15, 2016 1:38 pm

Tinman,

Another thing I noticed about the new calculator is the addition of the "Easy/Moderate" pace. Is that the new 65% of VO2max or is that somewhere in between? Curious as to when you like utilizing that pace range.

--Joel

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